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Jesus also saved people from being stoned, BTW.

Interesting...

f-d,
I guess the big deal about tax-payer funded elections is that the pledge was made to give the impression that he wouldn't be beholden to special interest money.

The campaign reformists contend public funded campaigns are "more pure" because the candidates don't have to cozy up to special interest groups and their members to raise money.

Obama put himself as the candidate of change and new policts. Breaking the pledge and taking the standard route to financing the campaign blows a hole through the rhetoric.

Me? I think public campaign funding is a bad idea. I didn't make the pledge, though. He's just more of the same, but shinier.

Where's his pledge? Never made one.

He said he'd aggressively pursue that angle, but maybe as he's learned more about how that system is abused, he's decided it's not the best route.

What I don't understand is you say you agree with him and call him "another typical politician".

Why not commend him for making a brave call you agree with?

WWBHOD.

Link

"If you are nominated for President in 2008 and your major opponents agree to forgo private funding in the general election campaign, will you participate in the presidential public financing system?”

B Hussein Obama: "Yes. In February 2007, I proposed a novel way to preserve the strength of the public financing system in the 2008 election. My plan requires both major party candidates to agree on a fundraising truce, return excess money from donors, and stay within the public financing system for the general election. My proposal followed announcements by some presidential candidates that they would forgo public financing so they could raise unlimited funds in the general election. The Federal Election Commission ruled the proposal legal, and Senator John McCain (R-AZ) has already pledged to accept this fundraising pledge. If I am the Democratic nominee, I will aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election."

Maybe a staffer wrote it.

Why am I not commending him? Because I don't really commend politicians. If they're doing what they're supposed to do, fine. That's what they said they'd do and what is expected. If they back out of what they said they'd do, I think it needs to be examined/discussed.

Why aren't you disgusted that he's going to chase after special interest money?

Why aren't you disgusted that he's going to chase after special interest money?

Has he done this yet? What makes you think he will now?

He made the pledge before he realized how much he'd be able to raise - it was a dumb move.

But pretty much everyone knew this was coming, so I'm not exactly "disgusted."

I don't see the disconnect.

He's another typical politician.

I think the public financing system is a bad idea.

The two don't go hand in hand.

I think the financing, as it's done now, is flawed but not terrible.

I think if someone is posturing as a new brand of politician and they show through their actions that they're lying, they should be called to account for it.

So, while I think the public financed campaigns should go away, I also think people should be asked why they're two-faced when it nears "crunch time."

Dino, f-d, Jules, FB,
Along the lines of "seeing this coming," I also don't really expect you guys to be disgusted or upset that Obama's kinda becoming a fraud.

Has he done this yet? What makes you think he will now?

He made the pledge before he realized how much he'd be able to raise - it was a dumb move.

But pretty much everyone knew this was coming, so I'm not exactly "disgusted."

The pragmatist in you says the move was coming.

The Obama supporter in you says, "Just keep believin' that Obama won't back out of the next promise."

I'm supposed to trust this guy that he won't do it? Why? Because he said so a month prior? He's already shown he has no problem flip-flopping and breaking promises.

It really disgusts me that one of these clowns is going to be the next POTUS. They have both spewed so much bullshit in the last week or so that I don't think I am going to be able to follow this thing all the way to November.

Dino, f-d, Jules, FB,
Along the lines of "seeing this coming," I also don't really expect you guys to be disgusted or upset that Obama's kinda becoming a fraud.

NTFF!

NC, seriously...he just did what you ultimately hoped he would.

Are you proud he made the right decision that you agree with?

Why am I not commending him? Because I don't really commend politicians. If they're doing what they're supposed to do, fine. That's what they said they'd do and what is expected. If they back out of what they said they'd do, I think it needs to be examined/discussed.

Why aren't you disgusted that he's going to chase after special interest money?

He said he'd "aggressively pursue" it. He didn't swear on a stack of bibles that he'd do it and he didn't base his campaign on it.

People can be upset about his change of heart if they want, but this doesn't surprise or disappoint me.

I also never felt like he "pledged" or closed the door on this route.

When I go down the list of reasons I've been backing Obama (among the viable candidates) this wasn't at the bottom of that list...it wasn't even ON the list.

Here's an interesting question I've thought about a lot lately and while it doesn't apply directly to this situation, it jogged my memory.

What kind of President do we want: One who will make a decision and stand by it regardless of how they feel at a later date OR one who is willing to amend their position on something if they learn new information/feel differently as things move forward?

The democrats and Republicans like to sling mud and it seems like (in general) they are willing to stick to guns no matter how bad of a decision it turns out to be. They call the person who changes their mind a "flip flopper", but what kind of person can honestly say the first thought or decision they've made on a matter is always the right one?

I think about Iraq, oil, global warming, no child left behind, etc., etc., etc. if something isn't working, I don't think you should instantly reverse field, but what's wrong with saying "I got it wrong" or "based on recent developments, we need to change our angle"?

He was asked a direct question and gave a clear answer. You think a pledge needs to be on a Koran for it to count for this guy? He backed out of a clear plank in his "new direction" campaign..

Let's put it this way. Bush marketed himself as a "Uniter, not a divider." Do you ever mock that expression, because you see the nation as more divided? Do you think people who claim he is a uniter should be asked to explain some things you see as clearly contradicting that message?

Well, I seem to recall people swooning, even fainting, over how new and different Obama is. Chris Matthews' leg was a tinglin'. As the light shines closer and his character is tested, we find his word - excuse me, His Word - isn't as authentic as publicized. Politics will always come second to character for this guy.

f-d,
Now we're getting to the good spin.

Breaking a promise that can easily be kept is "pragmatic!"

He and McCain could both opt for public funding. He just doesn't want to because of political expediency. It has nothing to do with principle. It has nothing to do with facts changing, since the election finincing laws haven't changed.

Or did the laws change since he started running? How did his situation change, other than politically?

Apparently this "pledge" meant a lot to you personally, so I guess I can understand how you would feel this way.

A hedged answer on a question I didn't care about (16 months ago) doesn't make me think He is a two-faced hypocrite.

I guess we're different that way.

I love the way your rage is building to the point where you're starting to believe the "messiah" propaganda, though. NTFF!

Now, I will give Obama good grades for starting to switch his position on NAFTA. Again, it's a matter of politics for him, but at least he's moved to the position supported by facts. He's putting together a better general election message by moving closer to the center.

McCain changed his position on drilling because the price of oil changed. Either we increase energy supply or cut demand. He looked at the situation (facts change) and changed his opinion.

He and McCain could both opt for public funding. He just doesn't want to because of political expediency. It has nothing to do with principle. It has nothing to do with facts changing, since the election finincing laws haven't changed.

Or did the laws change since he started running? How did his situation change, other than politically?

Could he have learned anything new about how the system can be manipulated or how the Republicans are planning to gain an advantage in the last 16 months (since he made a half-hearted promise to "pursue" matched funding)?

McCain just said he's in favor of drilling off-shore after saying for years that he is against it. Did I care? Hell no...if you learn something new or your opinion changes for good reason (whatever those reasons are), I'm a fan of someone willing to adjust their opinion.

f-d,
No rage, bud. I do like to poke fun at the "messiah" thing, though ("His Word"). Along the lines of "fanboy," though that's gotten old.

A hedged answer? When asked, he said, "Yes."

I guess I consider "Yes" a direct answer. We're different that way.

Could he have learned anything new about how the system can be manipulated or how the Republicans are planning to gain an advantage in the last 16 months (since he made a half-hearted promise to "pursue" matched funding)?


Do you honestly believe what you wrote? Honestly?

I guess I consider "Yes" a direct answer. We're different that way.

He followed that with a paragraph of hedging, so he clearly wasn't committing fully.

Again, I think his "pledge" a couple years back must have meant a lot more to you than it did to me.

Do you honestly believe what you wrote? Honestly?

Yeah...sure.

I know the public matching funds has MASSIVE holes in it for private donors and his advisors could have told him "You're not accepting a level playing field if you go this route...you're simply relinquishing an advantage to McCain".

The Obama supporter in you says, "Just keep believin' that Obama won't back out of the next promise."

The Obama supporter in me thinks he is a better choice than McCain, just as it believed he's a better choice then Clinton.

He is not the messiah. He is a politician. He does and will continue to do things that politicians do. I don't buy into the whole "he's a different kind of politician" thing any more than you do.

In the grand scheme of things, this is a pretty fucking minor "flip flop" that has nothing to do with how he will run the country, don't you think? He made a dumb call and he is correcting it. Spin it however you want but that's the fact, Jack.

By the way, the following words give anyone away when they are trying to criticize Obama:

- Messiah (or any close implication)
- Radical
- Socialist
- Anything regarding the Muslim religion
- Anything that begins with "questionable ______"

If you use any of those (and new keywords are constantly being added), you're a parrot with an agenda.

I'd love to discuss policy, though. I don't agree with everything he says just because I like him better than McCain and Clinton.

Shut up, fanboy!

He is half Muslim. That is an undisputed FACT.

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