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I never accused you of anything partisan however one would be naive or an Barry fanboy not to recognize that since securing the nomination he's been losing steam fast.

He's flip flopped on everything, isn't getting the donations he once was and has pissed off the far left kook liberals, the very base of supporters he based his campaign towards during the primaries.

Like I said a few pages back, given the current climate of this country if Barry doesn't win in November, the Democratic party should close up shop.

Be honest. If you were charged with the job of advising Obama and your only goal was to get him elected as President, you'd recommend he walk into McCain's wheelhouse and get battered for a few hours on national television?

No lies here. You'd mnake that recommendation as his campaign manager?

I’d offer an exchange, of sorts, Obama appears there if McCain appears in an Obama friendly forum.

He's already being cast as a flip-flopper. If he doesn't face tough crowds, he'll be painted as weak. All of this will be tied together in the Republican theme that he's just too inexperienced to be trusted with presidential decisions. He has to take tough questions and tough crowds because he's lost traction in front of the American people in terms of character.

BMA,
If they lose, the Dems should close up shop? Why? Because the Republican Party's demonstrated such great command of the populace?

Though I do agree the steam's left his campaign. They normally blare their fundraising totals the day the month closes, but have been pretty quiet about June.

He's flip flopped on everything, isn't getting the donations he once was and has pissed off the far left kook liberals, the very base of supporters he based his campaign towards during the primaries.

I just don't agree with much or any of that.

I do agree that the party so close its doors if they lose, though.

I’d offer an exchange, of sorts, Obama appears there if McCain appears in an Obama friendly forum.

And if he does nothing, they'll have exactly that...public, televised debates on neutral ground.

What McCain's doing is simple grandstanding, no different than some unimportant fighter "calling out" he champ in front of the press in an attempt to get a shot at the title.

I don't think McCain would agree to a "town hall debate" in front of 6,000 hard core liberals and I don't see the point of trading those blows, even if he agrees, I guess. Strategically, there isn't much reason for Obama cave.

You don't have to agree with it but it's the truth.

Oh, sorry..Barry hasn't flip flopped, he's "refined his position". My bad.

You don't have to agree with it but it's the truth.

Oh, sorry..Barry hasn't flip flopped, he's "refined his position". My bad.

"Flip flopping" is the name of the game at this stage of the game. Both candidates will track right (McCain to the extremely conservative Repulican base and Obama to the middle) at this point.

This process gets repeated every 4 years by both candidates in some way, shape, or form.

So, yeah, I agree he's hedging his bets politically, but everyone does it right now. How does this surprise you?

Barry is supposed to be an agent of change and bring a new type of politics to Washington!

CHANGE YOU CAN BELIEVE IN!

What kind of change can be expected if he doesn't try to win the election?

I guatantee Bob Barr would bring change to thw White House and people want change. Why isn't he winning?

Probably because like most 3rd party candidates, they wait until early summer to run and never get their message out. That and the fact that the current system makes it more difficult for a 3rd party to get on the ballot and the Dems/Repubs will even try to keep a 3rd party off the ballot in certain states. Gotta love "democracy".

far left kook liberals

BMA, are those upset by obama's vote on FISA to whom you are referring?

Yep.

Arnold says Flip-flopping is getting a bad rap.
Yo, click it

Yep.

ntf. mr. libertarian calling people angered by the government's blatant trampling of the right to privacy "kooks"

Yeah, the guy who's going to write in Ron Paul...

They are some prominent left wink kook sites, I believe one of them was the daily kos. Just because Barry originally supported ONE position I agree with doesn't equal me slandering libertarians.

The main reason I oppose this latest version is that it still clearly violates the Fourth Amendment of the Constitution by allowing the federal government to engage in the bulk collection of American citizens’ communications without a search warrant. That US citizens can have their private communication intercepted by the government without a search warrant is anti-American, deeply disturbing, and completely unacceptable.

In addition to gutting the fourth amendment, this measure will deprive Americans who have had their rights violated by telecommunication companies involved in the Administration’s illegal wiretapping program the right to seek redress in the courts for the wrongs committed against them. Worse, this measure provides for retroactive immunity, whereby individuals or organizations that broke the law as it existed are granted immunity for prior illegal actions once the law has been changed. Ex post facto laws have long been considered anathema in free societies under rule of law. Our Founding Fathers recognized this, including in Article I section 9 of the Constitution that “No bill of attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed.” How is this FISA bill not a variation of ex post facto? That alone should give pause to supporters of this measure.

Mr. Speaker, we should understand that decimating the protections that our Constitution provides us against the government is far more dangerous to the future of this country than whatever external threats may exist. We can protect this country without violating the Constitution and I urge my colleagues to reconsider their support for this measure.

-- Ron Paul, leftwing liberal kook, June 20 2008

NTFF, don't pull anything with the stretching, SZR.

BMA, you said that "liberal kooks" disagreed with Obama's FISA voting. No stretching here.

Then I named one of the sites I was referring to. Stay loose buddy, don't hurt yourself.

Whatever your point is, you've done a piss-poor job of presenting it.

Can we get this thread back on track now? It's been fine lately save the occasional Fred drive by, so I'd rather not have your less than stellar attempt at a "gotcha" moment towards me continue.

BMA, stop flip-flopping.

f-dallas, I'm repositioning my position. Change we can believe in.

You need to get on the straight talk express. Unlike the socialist flip-flopper Obama, we don't even pretend we care about our changes of opinion. We just "look forward".

Also, I challenge you to a debate in front of my extended family, in your udnerpants. Don't duck me.

I get that this is satire, but I honestly don't think at least 60%+ of America would get it.


Yo, click it

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