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If you were around in 1986 you'd know what I was talking about. I hated that damn team with a passion.

Are you seriously comparing those two in terms of hype? The 1986 Mets and the 2004 Red Sox? Hell, the latter used the former as motivation for all their crying and whining that later turned into chest-pounding.

that said, your implication that the tragedy of katrina was somehow less than that that of 9/11 because, to paraphrase, they "shoudna' been there in the first place" is ridiculous and completely misses the point.

F4F (and Dino to a degree)...

I'll hit both your points at 1x:

OF COURSE I realize that not everyone could evaccuate, and I am not trivializing the losses reaped by those who DID leave, only to comeback to a house full of water, and then the resultant mold, only to be shafted by their insurance companies, etc etc...


BUT, what Im saying is that for all the hullabaloo, network specials, movies etc surrounding 9-1-1, it never rivaled THIS mania- that's what it is, MANIA. And the fact that at least IN PART (There's no way around this fellas) there's at least SOME aspect of "some of these people coulda been spared" whereas in NY its not even contestable- well, I guess Im just scratchin my head at the Media's placing a higher 'tragedy tag' to N.O. than a TERRORIST ATTACK. It's just misplaced in football, and im sorry but 10 outta 10 times, to me, 911 is a bigger tragedy.

Unexpected.
No warnings.
No looting afterward.
No rapes, no shooting at releif efforts from the streets (amok with anarchy).

SOrry, if there was ever to be a time when the league decided to have an agenda shoved down the collective throats- it shoulda been then, not now.

F, the Saints 'fans' didnt give a looters ass about an effin football team for the BETTER PART OF THEIR ENTIRE EXISTENCE. THE WHOLE THING SUCKS>!

I'm rooting for New Orleans because:

1) They have a great offense that is fun to watch (unless you are counting on them to go 3-and-out while running the ball in hopes your team will get one last chance on offense after the coach inexplicably pussied out and punted with the season on the line).

2) New Orleans' offense should be able to matchup with either Indy or Bellichek's defense in what will likely be an exciting game against Indy or hopefully a soul-crushing, Masshole-defeating blowout of New England. Either way, it would be nice to see the NFC win and silence the "experts" who unanimously declared the NFC to be inferior. I don't have any faith in Chicago's overhyped defense that does nothing but give up points these days, and I think Lovie Smith is a dumber coach than Reid.

3) If the Saints win the whole enchilada, every Eagles fan will have countless reasons to be pissed at their favorite franchi$e, knowing that Reid blew a real shot at the Super Bowl by following the organizational mantra and playing it safe. This will make me very happy because it will give me something to bitch about.

4) I happen to love visiting New Orleans, and I have friends there. It's one of the more fun places on Earth. Katrina aside, I'm sure New Orleans would enjoy the win.


But I gotta tell ya that a Saints victory won't change a damn thing because people in New Orleans are always having a good time. That city lives to party, and when I go down there for Mardi Gras two weeks after the Super Bowl, I highly doubt anyone will be thinking about the New Orleans Saints.

Oh, I almost forgot. I enjoy seeing franchises who have never won the Super Bowl get their Lombardi before the Eagles do. It's a comforting thought while I reap the benefits of devotion to a team that embodies the Gold Standard.

While the Eagles' trophy case is barren, they have the most kick-ass balance sheet in the NFL.

I enjoy seeing franchises who have never won the Super Bowl get their Lombardi before the Eagles do

Me too. And in the past few years we got to cross the Pats, Bucs, and Rams off of that list.

seth, i think the point is this: katrina had a greater direct impact on more people than the planes did to those in new york on 9/11. for the vast majority of new yorkers (those weren't killed or close to someone who had been), life went on. i'm not talking about the impact that 9/11 had on the collective psyche or anything like that; i'm talking about the actual functioning of day-to-day life. a relatively small part of nyc's infrastructure was destroyed - NO was almost completed devastated.

in NO, the fate of the entire city hung in the balance. there was legitimate debate about whether NO should be abandoned all together - nyc of course faced no such question.

From the perspective of the fate of the cities themselves, NO faced (and still faces) a much more dire situation.

i guess my point is that 9/11 was almost as much of a national event as an nyc one (i say this as someone who was living in manhattan at the time), while katrina had much greater impact on the city of new orleans itself relative to the rest of the country. because of this, the nation focused more of its sympathy after 9/11 on those who were directly effected - FDNY, NYPD, the people in the towers and the planes. sympathy for nyc at large was less prominent (and rightly so). in NO, the whole f-in city was directly affected, hence the more media attention to the city than nyc received.

ugh. definitely time to drink.

The Saints are the NEW GOLD STANDARD

And not for nothing as an Eagles fan (Philly fan) it would sicken me to see the Saints win the Super Bowl.

Probably more sickening than when the Bucs won and the Rams.

The Saints are the worst franchise in NFL history. Their fans are a joke. Their owner was going to move the team after Katrina.

To see them win a Super Bowl before the Eagles would be another dagger in the heart.

Here's hoping Da Bears win by a FG in OT so they can feel the agony of DEFEAT once more.

So with that I wouldn't be surprised if the Saints won it all. Seems like the NFL would like nothing better not to mention the media.

After all they are the NEW GOLD STANDARD of the NFL.

To threadjack a bit...

Does anyone prescribe to my (usual) theory that you might as well root for the team that knocked you out of the playoffs, since it's better to lose to the champ along the way than have lost to some other loser?

Of all the teams in the NFC, I'd rather root for either of the ones still in it than the three that lost.

Not saying I'm some kinda Saints fan now, and all of this lousy media hype aside.

Nah... rooting for a team just because your team lost to them is simply living in denial that the Eagles are better than any other team that advanced farther. lt's hardly any consolation.

F rootin for who knocked you out.
Tell me you pulled for the Boys in that 1 bowl, or the G-men in their bowl vs the Ravens...if you did, maybe just maybe your EMB material (kiddin).


As for this:

seth, i think the point is this: katrina had a greater direct impact on more people than the planes did to those in new york on 9/11.


Callin the old BS on that- and for the precise reason you later stated at the end:
IT AFFECTED FAR MORE PEOPLE, FAR MORE AND OUR DAY TO DAY IS SO DRASTICALLY AFFECTED- from terror color coding on CNN, to airport security, to no liquids with pot residue allowed to board a plane, to no razors on a plane, to EVERY company moving to ID badges, to Terror Hotlines being flashed on the scrolling signs on all major bridges in the country, to an EFFIN WAR-

Sorry- no way ANYONE is convincin me otherwise.

F New Orleans as something that, if you aint on board for, makes you a politically incorrect social pariah-

This is FOOTBALL.
It aint a relief effort.
It aint charity.
It aint politics.
It aint the Red Cross.

Its effin Football.
And whoever had to walk into that Dome stood NO CHANCE. Just like the only runaway team all yr in the NFC stands NO CHANCE on Sunday if they allow N.O. to hang around.

AND THAT'S WHAT SICKENS ME.
I DO NOT WANT TO THINK THAT IN ANY WAY A SPORT I LOVE IS NOT 100% GENUINE BUT THAT'S NEVER BEEN MORE EVIDENT.

Talon, enjoy rootin for Team Gator Bait.

I'm actually tempted to wear another teams colors this sunday- Thats how much this has been pissin me off- EVEN BEFORE THE EFFIN BIRDS GAME LAST SAT.

I CANNOT STAND THIS.

I wasn't this upset at the closin of the Vet, loss in the NFCCG to TB.

Honestly.
Cause I think, scratch that- KNOW other forces were at work here. It's clear to just watch (IF YOU DARE) the NFL Replay version of the game.

If you know A LICK about the game, you'll notice (Courtesy one Donnie Schiffer who analyzed EACH stinkin play) #70 holds on not most, not a lot, but EVERY STINKIN PLAY!

How about the fwd progress rule bein' shelved for the last Saints TD?

The spot of Westy's 1st down run to set up 1st and goal, bein called 2nd and 1?
FINALLY the national media steps up (Kinda)- Some Cosell guy I caught on ESPN2 last nite, and Baldinger who works for FOX,both called it the worst spot of the season- 1 guy said EVER, given the situation.

Did they have a shot to win? Yes, a GIFT turnover that had even the commish and refs nervous, was handled 'adeptly' by the uber conservative Fat Bastard.

BUT- EVERYONE was shittin their drawers yo, when the Bush Bobble occurred. Little did they know...

God i am SO EFFIN BITTER , Im actually going to go out and buy an Ulracher Jersey tomorrow. I SWEAR IT!

I could honestly care less who wins the Superbowl now.

I don't think the game was "fixed", if ant game was "fixed" it was that Pittsburgh-Dallas Superbowl (interceptions right to the guy? C'mon)

OK, im w/ ya so far, so a trend could be in the makin then? Out w/ Tagliabue, in wit da fix?

Look- Im not sayin "MY" Bears cant go out and win on Sunday- all im sayin is the same that happened in the Birds' game: If its close, they'll make themselves a part of the game and N.O. will have every chance to win...doesn't mean THEY WILL WIN, means they'll have every shot.

OK, im w/ ya so far, so a trend could be in the makin then? Out w/ Tagliabue, in wit da fix?

Look- Im not sayin "MY" Bears cant go out and win on Sunday- all im sayin is LOOK OUT if it's the same as happened in the Birds' game:

If its close, they'll make themselves a part of the game and N.O. will have every chance to win...doesn't mean THEY WILL WIN, means they'll have every shot.

I've seen some double posts in my day... but a 10 minute delay!?!

Had to be the booze.

Seth, welcome to the close-knit "Dark Tivo Complainists" community.

The Eagles lost that game, no doubt. And they were totally jobbed by some bush league refereeing. If you feel like it, take that list of yours and compare it to the game thread - I'll bet most of it was posted by the 5 or 6 of us on that thread as the game went on.

Seth (and I haven't looked this up) but I think the expression is actually Namby pamby.

No predictions here. I think the Saints probably will win, b/c I think the Bears are a very flawed team, though their offense is just competent enough to win.

I think this could be the year Indy gets over the hump. The Pats have lost too many players over the years, and eventually that has to catch up with you, even if your QB is Mr. Clutch and your coach is an ALLEGED genius.

But I hope the Pats win (even though I like Dungy) b/c I don't want to see Manning win.

if Mamby pamby is some kind of inside joke, then I stand corrected

I'm going Pats and Saints.

EVERYONE is calling this game a Colts victory. As previously mentioned, Tom Brady is 10-0 in domes, the Pats own the Colts, Manning has been PUTIRD in the playoffs, Brady...obviously...knows how to win big games.

I just can't leave the Pats, in the playoffs, against Manning on the table WITH points. I'd be kicking myself for weeks if I did.

I just think Manning is average against the 3-4 and the Pats have his numebr inside and out. Fro a guy who's never been good in pressure situations (playoff pressure, at elast), this is going to be the biggest pressure game of Manning's life.

I'm taking the Saints because the Bears defense STINKS and has since they lost Brown and Harris. They are allowing 26 points per game since they lost those guys. The Saints defense isn't any better, but I think Chicago's offense is more likely to make critical mistakes.

Also, Brees is an outdoor, cold weather QB. McAllister is a big, bruising, 3 yards and a cloud of dust type back. Colsten is a huge, strong possession receiver.

Normally, you'd have to go against the Dome team going north in the playoffs but I could make a pretty good argument that the dome-locked Saints are more suited to run their offense in the cold than the Bears.

I think this game could start out with everyone playing conservatively, but I wouldn't be chokced at all if a shootout took place at some point. We're looking at 2 defenses with serious, fatal flaws. The Saints obviously aren't as good as the Bears on D, but the Saints offense is so superior to the Bears O, I think it levels the field.

Not rooting for anything other than my bets here. I only care about the points here, but I am taking the Pats and Saints today.

F-d, I like your logic but have two road teams ever won on the same Conf Champ Weekend?

I don't know if it has ever happened, and it would be a longshot. That said, if it was going to happen any year, this one would be it, IMO.

As long as both games are tight, I'm good...should be a good day either way.

Good Bye Saints!

Da Bears!!!

Never a doubt!!!

What's that old saying? You can't handicap one of the worst playoff chokes in history?

Fuck you very much, Drew Brees. Where was that effort last week?

Oh well...this one coming up is the big one. Let's see if I can go 0-2!

Those who do not learn from history are doomed (domed?) to repeat it.

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