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When do they stubbornly keep playing a shitbag b/c of not wanting to admit being wrong?

See Mahe, Reno.

You cannot tell me that he was the only player in the NFL capable of being a backup running back who can't run/punt returner who can call a fair catch.

Also, take a gander at Pinkston, Todd.

And as far as not admitting their mistakes goes, look no further than the distorted pass-run ratio which has yet to yield multiple championships.

I'm just talking personnele, and as a #2, Pinkston was fine.

Mahe I guess, but he had such a limited role, and didn't fuck up a lot. He just didn't play well. It's not like there are 100 great PR's/3rd RB's out there.

But, 2 players out of 10 years (even though I disagree with them) is really not that big a deal

I'm talking more about the organizational philosophy, a philosophy which is usually manifested in the acquisition of players.

Sorry, since you were talking about the Raiders admitting their mistake with Hall, I thought you were talking personnel with the Eagles

I think he IS talking about personnel and how that organizational philosophy FAILS.

Pinkston sucked. His best year was opposite TO. At WR, a position that they utilized relentlessly, they were stubborn in trusting Thrash long after he proved he sucked. Stubborn in holding onto Mitchell for as long as they did. Stubborn for refusing to budge with regards to Trotter, lost him...(remember Jurevicious running by Levon Kirkland) and cost them the NFCC. Of course, Kirkland wasn't the entire problem. Reno Mahe is probably the best example. Ryan Moats was on this team two years too long.

Basically, mule-ass stubborn characterizes the philosophy of this organization in every facet, personnel, play calling, etc.

What Talon was pointing out, was that even as assbackwards as the Raiders are, they at least recognized it was time to get off the can cuz the crap wasn't en route.

I think it's more reasonable to give a 1st round pick 4 years to pan out, without giving him playing time that hurts the team, than cutting a guy you just signed halfway through the season (and I said Hall was overrated in the first place). It's not like Freddie, playing 3rd and 4th WR, was taking playing time from some gem.

Pinkston was good at stretching the field, that's what he did. He had 2 good years (year before TO, year of TO) of this out of 4 years, then he was gone. That's not stubborn, he filled a role here and was good at it. Once he was hurt and couldn't do it, he was gone.

So I don't think the problem is holding onto guys too long and forcing them into time that takes away from better options. I think it's just they think their system is more important than who is in it (for the most part)

Extending your argument, KB, the belief in the system.

If the system is flawless and merely needs guys with a pulse to run it, then it would definitely result into holding onto players who aren't good enough, yes?

Not at all. These guys (Trotter is a good example) get a big head, need a new contract, and leave. Or they're older guys (Kirkland, Bishop) who are at the end of their careers and are done. Or they're undrafted free agents (Fraley) who play a position that can be replaced easily.

KB, this has become circular. Trotter's handling created his stupid emotional response. His absence didn't help the Birds during his brief sojourn. Could they have beaten the Bucs with him? Maybe. Maybe not, but I'd like the chances better. Blaine Bishop was a liability. Changing him was a necessity out of their control.

Basically, when it comes to skill positions, they overstay their welcome with players on offense. They've not been so with the defense.

I think the players I've shown (and players like Moats, Thrash, etc.) prove they don't hold on to skill guys too long. Thrash was only here two years, and one of them was pretty good considering the offense they had around him.

three years
2001, 2002, 2003

WHoops, sorry. Had a good year (over 800, 8td's), then they gave him one more shot to be a #1 before going after TO.

I think it's more about stats with these players because the crumbled and folded in crunch time.

Neither Thrash nor Pinkston ever showed up in the NFC Championship games.

And while Pinkston was a deep threat, that guy was a total coward. Case in point, the pass "he lost in the lights" against Washington when he was in danger of getting hit. He was no character guy.

I think it's telling that with the exception of Thrash, whose entire career is somewhat of a miracle (there must be something in that whole pointing to the sky thing, these prized possessions of the Eagles who overstay their welcome don't ever go on to make an impact, or even play, elsewhere.

P.S. I'm too busy at work to argue with you today, so before you come back at me, I'll just concede the point.

Yeah, i mentioned that above. I think we just disagree on what is "too long", and I don't think there's anyway around that

Adam Shefter reporting the Skins have signed Deangelo Hall.

It actually seems like a pretty good deal for them. They'll be paying him $500K for the rest of the season and they agreed they wouldn't franchise him at the end of the year so he can hit the FA market again.

He's overrated and was AWFUL in Oakland, but he'll be drawing the same paycheck as Joselio Hanson the rest of the season, so it's a decent risk/reward, IMO.

Hall's only good game with the Skins will be on Dec. 21 and the only quality game for Roy "WR" Williams will be on Dec. 28. It happens that way every time.

Anyone else surprised he didn't go to Dallas?

Considering the incident between him and TO, no.

My guess is that locker room is already on pins and needles and JJ's having a hard time keeping it together. Or he recognizes Hall as overrated and probably not worth picking up.

It's a very good risk/reward for the Skins. Hall's playing for his next contract (especially in the uncapped year), so if he acts up or plays like crap, any chance of a big(ger) payday is flushed down the drain. And the Skins get an above average player on the cheap with no long term financial commitments. Win/win.

Shock of shocks, Andrews may be done for the season.

A "source close to the situation" says Andrews is not having depression symptoms and remains motivated to play football, but if that source is close to the Eagles, it would be hard to believe anything he says.

Also, the article has this Andy Reid quote, which I envision coming from the mouth of Hulk Hogan:

"One thing if you hang around long enough, you'll find out there's no apprehension going into any game, brother," he replied.
click here

Another shock of shocks (NOT).... The iggles have HUGE issues to address for the remainder of the year and the offseason...

I wish Andrews would just off himself so the team can cease to be held hostage by his female tendencies.

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